Forum: F-16 Design & Construction

Why...

1- is it not possible to retrofit Block 50-52 F16's to the Block 60 Configeration?

2- Why does the Air Force Not get teeh Block 60 as a backup in the event of the F-35 cutbacks?

3-Who makes kits of the Block 60 F-16?

Hugh Gilmartin

F-16.net Sponsor

Last edited by apags27 on Mar 15, 2007 - 01:21 AM; edited 1 time in total

1- no, it is not possible, there are significant sturctural differences

2- USAF didn't pay for the development of Block 60, UAE did

3- assuming you mean scale model kits, no one. There are some resin aftermarket sets that approximate Isreal's Block 52+, but not Block 60

actually there are models of the Block 60's LM sells them at there souvenir stands at the plant in Fort Worth if you really want one i think they have a web site that you can buy LM stuff.

F-16E is designed and built for UAE AF, comparing with F-16C/D Block50/52, it has around 70% difference in hardware and 100% difference in software, which are even bigger than the difference between F/A-18C/D and F/A-18E/F.

Therefore, it is meaningless for USAF to retrofit Block 50-52 F16's to the Block 60 configeration..............

The earliest model that the F110-GE-132 engine was certified for was the blk 30. The primary difference between this engine and the blk 60 is the ECS interface requirements (not getting into structural imposed limitations). The blk 30 retains 2 left and 1 right bleed. The Blk 60 version is a single left and right bleed. This later change was a result on the ECS systems splitting the primary/secondary heat exchanger in one primary and one secondary, basically doubling the capacity of the former and allowing for use of the higher bleed Temps/Pressures that occur on the left hand bleed. As a matter of fact, it hasn't been questioned or prove, but after one of the high speed test of the blk 30 that was off TM that day, it had some very small blistering of the leading edge paint. Not speculating but never heard any questions brought up at any of the post-flights.

hjgil510jjr wrote:

Why...

1- is it not possible to retrofit Block 50-52 F16's to the Block 60 Configeration?

2- Why does the Air Force Not get teeh Block 60 as a backup in the event of the F-35 cutbacks?

3-Who makes kits of the Block 60 F-16?

Hugh Gilmartin

1) Its not possible, its a totally different beast so to say.

2) Who said LM does not have it as a backup plan? What you don't understand is that UAE has basically funded the development of future advances we now have in the JSF such as the AESA Radar and fiber-optic technologies to name a few. So by the time UAE pilots have become proficient in the Blk 60 the JSF and F-22's will already be in the sky's fulltime.

3) I assume your talking about model kits, and they are on the net.

Cheers,

ViperDude

ViperDude is correct in 1) and then again 1) depends on just what it is the customer would want. Another words if you want performance plus from the engine, a blk 30 could be engine retrofitted. If you want performance from the RADAR and AVIONICS suite perspective ( not necessarily from an engine retofit) then ViperDude would be correct and your stuck with a blk60 as is.

toan wrote:

F-16E is designed and built for UAE AF, comparing with F-16C/D Block50/52, it has around 70% difference in hardware and 100% difference in software, which are even bigger than the difference between F/A-18C/D and F/A-18E/F.

Therefore, it is meaningless for USAF to retrofit Block 50-52 F16's to the Block 60 configeration..............

Yep, that's the bare bones on between both blocks alright!

Mike V

F16JOAT wrote:

The earliest model that the F110-GE-132 engine was certified for was the blk 30. The primary difference between this engine and the blk 60 is the ECS interface requirements (not getting into structural imposed limitations). The blk 30 retains 2 left and 1 right bleed. The Blk 60 version is a single left and right bleed. This later change was a result on the ECS systems splitting the primary/secondary heat exchanger in one primary and one secondary, basically doubling the capacity of the former and allowing for use of the higher bleed Temps/Pressures that occur on the left hand bleed. As a matter of fact, it hasn't been questioned or prove, but after one of the high speed test of the blk 30 that was off TM that day, it had some very small blistering of the leading edge paint. Not speculating but never heard any questions brought up at any of the post-flights.

The main -132 Flight test phase was flown in my old jet, 86-0359 at Edwards. Being block 30 fitted with a GE -129, it was already the fastest Viper in the fleet with. With the -132, most of the top speeds recorded at altitude were calssified.

Mike V

86-0359 translates to 5C-465 in LM Aero conversion. By the way, Dan L ( respect his privacy) was the pilot. Maybe you may be aware of that.
I'll have to agree to that fact that if USAF wants to train our pilots to become Vegas Racers , then maybe the -132 would be great for the straight away. But like all things, even though USAF followed the build of the blk60 for UAE, they (USAF) that is, would still change out a lot of things to get back to their common suites, otherwise it would be a whole new ball game of software, AGE, etc. By the way, there has been a RFP to do just that.

ViperDude wrote:

2) Who said LM does not have it as a backup plan? What you don't understand is that UAE has basically funded the development of future advances we now have in the JSF such as the AESA Radar and fiber-optic technologies to name a few. So by the time UAE pilots have become proficient in the Blk 60 the JSF and F-22's will already be in the sky's fulltime.

First off, UAE did not fund the development of ANYTHING we have in our aircraft. They funded the integration of technology we developed and released to them. That's not to say that integration is trivial...it's not. If we decide to integrate AESA and other issues into the Viper, then it will likely be easier, but that is totally unrelated to the JSF.

Forum: F-16 Design & Construction

F-16 Block 60's