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Thumper3181
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 Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 06:11 PM
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Senior member
Joined: Jun 23, 2006
Posts: 434
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Have a look at my registration date.
Oops, I may be a dufus. |
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Sponsor
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 Posted: Nov 18, 2008 - 5:07 PM
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F-16.net Sponsor
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elp
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Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 06:58 PM
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F-16.net Editor
Joined: Sep 23, 2003
Posts: 2862
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Thumper3181 wrote:
Elp you have brought up some good points and they are some of the reasons why I wish it where 1990 again and Dick Cheney did not have a brain fart when he opted not to develop the Tomcat21 but it is not 1990 and fortunately the SH did not turn out too badly. Sure the SH has some shortcomings but it is nothing that cannot be mitigated.. Will it be up to task 30 years from now no one can say. What we can be certain of is that th US has a very large lead in avionics, EW, stealth and radar and it is not likely to change much. The SH will either be upgraded to meet the threat or UCAVs and the JSF will take it's place. The Navy seems to be pretty happy with the SH. You and I know darn well that if they where not they would be screaming bloody murder.
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COTS hardware and software are being put in Flankers in a variety of creative flavors
Maybe but most of the things done to the SH are not COTs.
Consider this. Way back in the good old days the big three built muscle cars. They did one thing well. Go very fast in a straight line. Thats a Flanker. Nowadays we may not have cars that are quite as powerful but they go fast enough and they can turn and stop and do it all in comfort.
The design philosophy behind the SH is truly brilliant. They took a lemon and made lemonade. Which is good.
Well... the French Sagem Nav aids are the option of choice for the discerning Flanker hot rodder... ditto with various Israeli cockpit displays and other cockpit options. And of course putting a Litening on a Flanker isn't hard for them... giving you all the Litening options... a little more work. We are no longer the absolute brain trust on avionics. Especially considering, various contractors in France, Israel, and India... want to cash in on the big weapons market out there. Funny in a way. We provide gobs of mil aid to Israel so they in turn can put our forces at risk in the pacrim via weapons sales/development. Amusing even.
Unfortunately the Flanker is only going to get better avionics and weapons systems as time goes on. A lot of it third party stuff. And at least the base part of the Flanker starts with hardcore performance. Super Hornet starts with mediocre performance. When Flankers get better avionics... as they will inside of 10-20 years... any avionics advantage Super Hornet has will be minimal. Super Hornet over the years will still have to potentially deal with this threat. If you had a Cope India exercise right now with Indian Flankers vs. the Super Hornet, SH would get cut to ribbons. And that is.... today. Avionics or no, the Super Hornet can not contempt of engage the Flanker. That is a serious Achilles heel to take into an air domination scenario. |
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checksixx
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Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 08:08 PM
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Elite 1K
Joined: Jul 20, 2005
Posts: 1035
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elp wrote:
If you had a Cope India exercise right now with Indian Flankers vs. the Super Hornet, SH would get cut to ribbons. And that is.... today.
Whoa...keep in mind that if they'd let us fight the way we trained and not tie our hands behind our backs, the outcome could be very different!
Check |
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elp
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Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 08:33 PM
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F-16.net Editor
Joined: Sep 23, 2003
Posts: 2862
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| Yeah... I always like to believe that... then Gen Jumper ( God bless him ), right afterward, runs off to congress and tells everyone, what a serious disadvantage it is out there in the real world and that the big bad SU is going to come and get us, and by god, Cope India is proof. |
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checksixx
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Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 09:27 PM
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Elite 1K
Joined: Jul 20, 2005
Posts: 1035
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| I worked for General Jumper at ACC HQ...that was said in support of the Raptor program. It was an easy and logical play for funding. Hell I would have done it too! |
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Thumper3181
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Posted: Feb 27, 2007 - 10:42 PM
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Senior member
Joined: Jun 23, 2006
Posts: 434
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It was an easy and logical play for funding. Hell I would have done it too!
I agree we need many more Raptors.
Cope India has been gone over many times as has all DACT exercises. They are exactly that, exercises. Notice the Navy is not getting too nervous about JSF being delayed.
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with various Israeli cockpit displays and other cockpit options
Exporting technology even to your closest allies has always been risky. The shenanigans between India/Israel and China/Israel should be reason to give us pause whenever we talk about source code or exporting the Raptor.
The SH has 17 cubic feet of empty space for growth. That is about the size of a passenger car trunk. Do you really think they will stop at Block II or III? Look at the B-52. |
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elp
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Posted: Feb 28, 2007 - 08:29 PM
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F-16.net Editor
Joined: Sep 23, 2003
Posts: 2862
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Thumper3181 wrote:
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It was an easy and logical play for funding. Hell I would have done it too!
I agree we need many more Raptors.
Cope India has been gone over many times as has all DACT exercises. They are exactly that, exercises. Notice the Navy is not getting too nervous about JSF being delayed.
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with various Israeli cockpit displays and other cockpit options
Exporting technology even to your closest allies has always been risky. The shenanigans between India/Israel and China/Israel should be reason to give us pause whenever we talk about source code or exporting the Raptor.
The SH has 17 cubic feet of empty space for growth. That is about the size of a passenger car trunk. Do you really think they will stop at Block II or III? Look at the B-52.
Thanks T. You are right about the growth room. My feeling. And that is all it is... is that there is almost no end to the crap the creative mind can put in the Flanker 5, 10, 20 years from now.
Off topic: I think the SH will probably show to be one of the most safe aircraft as time goes by due to how easy it is to fly it. I think that buy itself is a good thing. |
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