Forum: F-35 Armament, Stores and Tactics

Amazing - who would have thought it was possible?

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Nice article. LMAO

It forgot to mention that the size of the attachment of these emails is directly proportional to its penetrating depth. The bunker-busters will have huge attachments of illegal Jerry Bruckheimer films!! Rolling Eyes

Last edited by Whiteman_B2 on May 08, 2005 - 09:10 PM; edited 3 times in total

There is still talk of putting a combat laser on the F(A)-35A. They've stated that the extra room left by the absence of the lift fan in A model has given rise to the idea of an electric generator driven by the engine. This could power a combat laser and give "inexhaustible" ammo. The talk is of mounting it on a small turret over the right intake where the gun would normally be. If tests are successful, this might be retrofitted into earlier F-35A's and be standard for all future craft. The problem is the UN ban on "blinding weapons". "International concern" has been expressed on what would happen when a "stray" shot hits the ground. This given that the common wisdom is that the laser would be most effective against, therefore be used most often against ground targets. The speculation is that it will not be an effective air combat weapon.(?)

http://www.you.com.au/news/1275.htm

According to the article, they now say it could be used as an air comabt weapon.

Another article:
http://www.jinsa.org/articles/articles.html/function/view/categoryid/164/documentid/1664/history/3,2360,656,164,1664

http://www.aviationnow.com/content/publ ... 8/aw32.htm

this link used to be valid, but i think you gotta register for the site now. anyways, it talks about laser weapons on the JSF. later models of the JSF may recieve microwave weapons that fry electronics or even plasma based weapons, but I don't know how legitimate those claims are.

WHAT THE..........

I am reading the latest Flight International and the RAF has indicated the intention to make a change to the design of the F-35 STOVL and incorporate a gun to the plane.
The only version that currently carries a gun is the CTOL version.

I just cannot help wondering what sort of clowns run the UK ministry of defense.
Not long ago they decided that guns were not needed in fighter aircraft. Now the want to add a gun that shoots green BEANS and add a COUNTER at the muzzle exit. Just unbelievable.

I am going to cancel my subscription of all the magazines that come from the UK. Had enough.

The laser idea on the JSF is not new, people have been looking at putting a laser on a fighter a/c for years now. The problem is this: we can't even fit one on a friggin' 747, much less on a fighter. I see it happening eventually, but not soon.

F+35 + HELLADS (http://www.technovelgy.com/ct/Science-Fiction-News.asp?NewsNum=444) == X-Wing Smile

Ciao,
Smithsguy

I saw this already. Dr Evil wanted freakin sharks with lasers.... instead he got rather ill tempered seabass. Laughing

nice delivery... and I agree completely. Now - LOWER ZEE GLOBE!!!!!

Common Avionics, engines, weapons and other such is all fine and dandy, but the air-frames should've been built seperately. I just look at the Boeing JSF and think that it would've been better for the Navy and Marines, while the LockMart JSF looked like a scaled down F-22 which probably made the AF brass cream their pants.
As for a Gun, Gatlings should be abandoned. A Pair or a single 30mm chain gun capable of firing 30mmX173mm rounds of the GAU-8 and 30mmX113mm of the Apache's M230 30mm gun. Good at both anti-air and close-air support.
The GAU-8 is over 20 feet long.

I kinda liked the ugly (Boeing) JSF, because those guys had the potential to build the thing with a production method that was less expensive, also not needing a bigger wing just to do the carrier thing ( where the F-35C needs this ).... etc... so here we are now with rising cost. Oh well.

Elite 1K Joined: May 26, 2005 - 08:39 PM Posts: 1496

Quote:

A Pair or a single 30mm chain gun capable of firing 30mmX173mm rounds of the GAU-8 and 30mmX113mm of the Apache's M230 30mm gun. Good at both anti-air and close-air support.
The GAU-8 is over 20 feet long.

Basic firearms 101: Barrel length = velocity. All things being equal, short barrel = low velocity, long barrel = high velocity. The M230 series of ammunition is nowhere near as lethal as the GAU-8 series.

Take a look at the Avenger system. The two biggest contributors to length are the ammunition drum and the barrel cluster.
If you look at a GAU-8 shell, it is literally the size of a milk bottle. All that space below the projectile is there to hold propellant right? Well if you have a short barreled cannon firing those rounds, most of that propellant will end up as a giant muzzle flash because you can only burn it so fast before the chamber pressure is too high and the gun blows itself apart. So your idea of a chain gun firing 30mmx173mm rounds only makes sense if you have a cannon with the same barrel length as the GAU-8, which makes it less than practical.

The 30mm cannon in the Apache is more of a very high velocity grenade launcher, and it excels at taking out soft and lightly armored targets. But it isn't good at anti-armor (which it wasn't meant to be). If you want a tank killing cannon, it is going to be BIG. If you want something to take out softish ground targets, 20mm at 6,000 RPM is just as good as 30mm at 600 or 1200 RPM. And while air to air cannon choices usually ends up as a religion argument, I'd guess most pilots would rather have an M61 shooting bursts at 6000 RPM rather than chunking slower 30mm shells at 1/5th the RPM.

Quote:

I'd guess most pilots would rather have an M61 shooting bursts at 6000 RPM rather than chunking slower 30mm shells at 1/5th the RPM.

If I were a pilot I would rather get smaller shells out faster than bigger shells slower. At least in A2A that is. The more lead I'd be able to throw out there the better.

I am not sure on the GAU-8s barrel lengths, the GAU-8s overal length is 25 feet from the muzzles to the tail end of the drive center. A chain gun would be slower firing but lighter, maybe a Gast version based off the Russians?

It was worth a shot, the A-10 and its gun is great against tanks. The common military idea is cluster munitions against troop formations, but what happens when the enemy gets real close to the grunts?

Anyone have any idea on how good the 25mm round fired by the GAU-12 is against ground targets?

On another note, anyone have any idea when the last confirmed gun kill took place?

johnqhitman wrote:

I am not sure on the GAU-8s barrel lengths, the GAU-8s overal length is 25 feet from the muzzles to the tail end of the drive center. A chain gun would be slower firing but lighter, maybe a Gast version based off the Russians?

It was worth a shot, the A-10 and its gun is great against tanks. The common military idea is cluster munitions against troop formations, but what happens when the enemy gets real close to the grunts?

Anyone have any idea on how good the 25mm round fired by the GAU-12 is against ground targets?

On another note, anyone have any idea when the last confirmed gun kill took place?

For the USAF I'm guessing it was the A-10 air to air kills against Mi-8's in Desert Storm.

-MArk

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