Forum: F-22A Raptor

http://www.aviationnow.com/avnow/news/c ... 207266.xml

Reading this, I am a bit confused. What is a Nunn-McCurdy violation?

Also, why do they quote the price of the F-22A at $338 million, when in fact it is roughly $135 after the initial 183 are bought, or if R&D is not taken into account?

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Last edited by boff180 on Aug 02, 2006 - 09:08 PM; edited 1 time in total

Nunn-McCurdy is an ammendment performed in 1982 to the Defence Authorisation Act of the US.

Basically, if a programs total costs increase by more than 25% from original estimates (classed as a violation) then it is to be cancelled immediately.

However there are 2 exceptions to this....
1. The Secretary of Defence certifies the program as a critical system.
2. The cost growth is attributable to certain specified changes in the program.

The ammendment was made permanent in 1983.

I believe an example of this act in action is the RAH-66 but I could be wrong.

Due to the act working in absolute total values, the unit cost includes R&D costs aswell. So the article is correct to give total costs in their article.

Andy

p.s. re: threads in f-35 section... will reply tomorrow, extremely busy tonight and only have time for a few quick posts.

Ok, thanks. I had a feeling it had to do with Budget Overruns. Shame. The F-22A kicks so much a$$, yet, it really can't do something simple like balance a checkbook.

Elite 1K Joined: May 26, 2005 - 08:39 PM Posts: 1496

Well, the issue at hand is originally the Air Force was going to buy 700+ F-22s. Now it's down to what, 180? The full cost of R&D gets applied across each airframe in the accounting world. Cut the production run in a quarter, R&D cost per jet quadruples.

skrip00 wrote:

The F-22A kicks so much a$$, yet, it really can't do something simple like balance a checkbook.

That's in the next software update..... Wink

Will Quicken run on an MMC? Smile

They're lumping R&D into the number (...again..) for political expediency, pure and simple. It's not like we can go to LockMart or Boeing and say "Umm...guys...about that $10 billion we gave ya for R&D? We're...uh...we're gonna need that back, sorry". They know R&D and other such monies are unrecoverable, but they also know that Joe or Jane Constituent are clueless on how DoD funding procedures work.

Look...the Raptor manufacturing infrastructure is pretty much in place now. Let's just go ahead and reset the planned purchase number back to 750 and watch what happens to the numbers!

So why dont they buy like 350 of them? WHERE DID IT ALL GO WRONG?

Elite 1K Joined: May 26, 2005 - 08:39 PM Posts: 1496

Quote:

WHERE DID IT ALL GO WRONG?

Congresscritters. Very Happy

The USAF should do a massive PR campaign. Maybe mass formation flyovers of one major city, each week. New York, DC, LA, SD, SF, LV, etc.

They need to generate public interest and let the citizens of this nation know why this aircraft is needed for the USAF. And how we are selling our pilots short by denying them this wonderful aircraft.

99% of American probably don't even know what the F-22A is!

The four natural enemies of F-22A: GAO, POGO, Fighter Mafia, and the war of global anti-terror

http://www.gpoaccess.gov/gaoreports/index.html

http://www.pogo.org/

POGO and the Fighter Mafia are fairly laughable enemies. I've lost all respect for Ricconi's opinion of the F-22A. That man would have our fighter boys fly F-5E Freedom Fighters into battle over the F-22A.

Active Member Joined: Jan 10, 2005 - 07:58 AM Posts: 137

Or do like they did in the 60s and fly supersonic over major cities. "You won't hear us until you need us. Buy Raptor bonds." Salute

Guysmiley wrote:

Quote:

WHERE DID IT ALL GO WRONG?

Congresscritters. Very Happy

!!!

You know what they say - figures don't lie, but liars can figure Wink

. Along with political correctness I'm truly sick of manipulating numbers to suit what you'd like. Don't lump it all together and say that buying another Raptor will cost another $350,000,000 dollars Evil or Very Mad

. Once those guys and gals in Congress can figure out how not to kite checks in the House bank, we'll talk about program funding.

Congresscritters - I like that Laughing

!!!

The reason that the F-22 buy was reduced was because the US did not and does not have the money to buy the the original 700+ order.

Your government is running a deficit. Translation: it is spending more money than it is taking in. Until you solve that your budgets will continue to get cut.

So they cut the buy to 400+ ac, then later smaller still.

If you want to buy more F-22s, come up with the money. There are 3 ways of doing this:

Option 1
Cancel the ABM and all future Air Tanker Cargo Aircraft programs and purchases.

Option 2
Pull out of Iraq.
That's 9 billion dollars per month that you can shift to ac procurement and army repair and refit expenses.

Option 3
Raise taxes by 20-30%

Cheers

Man, what's up with all these random characters coming out of the cyberspace woodwork to spread lies, disinformation and general unpleasantness?

I am beginning to think this is a coordinated effort of some kind...