Forum: F-16 News

Reported by Haaretz.com

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShAr ... mNo=740395

Also see: http://www.f-16.net/news_article1894.html

Anyone got any further details?

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Far be it from me to question the crew's decision loop, but if it was just a blown tire(s) as the article suggests, why not Select Jett the stores, burn off the gas and come back for, at the very worst, a wheels-up landing? Confused

Active member Joined: May 23, 2006 Posts: 101

After a week of ops a Sufa is dead and a Sa'ar 5 is disabled (for a long time if reports are correct). Although the F16 reportedly crashed while taking off (something fell burning from the sky over Beirut a couple of days ago), that is already too much for an operation against a technologically vastly inferior opponent. And also reportedly the IDF ground forces were repelled by Hizbullah in the border.
Check this out
http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/200 ... x.php#more
not entirely relevant but readworthy and with interesting embedded links.
Is it possible that modern tech applications' capability against this kind of threats is overestimated? Iraq ans Afghanistan is also an example for consideration. All these Kalshnikow bearers against the F16s and Networked Strykers are still around.

bozz wrote:

After a week of ops a Sufa is dead and a Sa'ar 5 is disabled (for a long time if reports are correct). Although the F16 reportedly crashed while taking off.....that is already too much for an operation against a technologically vastly inferior opponent.

You're....you're kidding...right? After a week of how many dozens of sorties out of how many bases and they've only lost 1 Viper to (allegedly) non-combat circumstances and you consider the op too much to handle? Don't you think if an IAF jet was shot down or damaged in combat you'd here it blared from every news network?

Active member Joined: May 23, 2006 Posts: 101

You are right, the argument is weak and I frankly do not believe that any airborn IDF assed was downed by enemy fire (even the Hizbullah TV did not claim an F16 downing), however my point is how much does modern expensive technology applications provide true solutions to unconventional threats. There are interesting points to argue both answers.
The Sa'ar 5 incident is wierd though. A Hizbullah silkworm?!

It happened during take-off. During the take-off run a tire was blown-up and the plane probably got out of control. Because it was heavliy armed the crew did what they were ordered to, eject. We need to wait for the investigation before we can get conclusions.

bozz, the Sa'ar 5 was hit by an Iranian-made C-802 missile that the navy was unaware of. They didn't know the Hizballah has got its hand on it.

Quote:

the Sa'ar 5 was hit by an Iranian-made C-802 missile that the navy was unaware of. They didn't know the Hizballah has got its hand on it.

Are'nt there any kind of warning receivers on these ships! I read that it was one of the most advanced in the Israeli navy!

Active member Joined: May 23, 2006 Posts: 101

Correct deepspace,
C-802 (CSS-N-8 or Yj-82 Saccade) is a fairly modern anti-ship missile and not deriving from the Silkworm family (as mistakenly reported by some sources like the site posted below). The thing is how the hell might this has been allowed to happen. Reportedly the multilayered defensive systems (barak, phalanx,NS-9003A/9005, ECM's) were off because such an attack was not anticipated and IAF was flying around which may be reasonable in an operational sense in this environment. It is still embarrassing though.
http://debka.com/article.php?aid=1184

I think the Sa'ar did not sink but returned to the shipyard for repairs ? Or is it a separate incident ?

Last edited by RoAF on Jul 20, 2006 - 12:03 PM; edited 1 time in total

Just a reminder for anyone involved in military ops: NEVER UNDERESTIMATE YOUR ENEMY!
Probably IDF got its lesson and some butts got kicked...
seat dreamer, the ship (Sa'ar 5) returned to port damaged - it's the same incident we are talking about.

Last edited by DeepSpace on Jul 20, 2006 - 12:13 PM; edited 1 time in total

True, it didn't sink and returned to the shipyard.

In the recent week the IDF/AF flown over 3,000 sorties, so such incidents might happen.

pafpilot wrote:

Are'nt there any kind of warning receivers on these ships! I read that it was one of the most advanced in the Israeli navy!

There are, but since they didn't know of such a threat they didn't operate them.

Active member Joined: May 23, 2006 Posts: 101

DeepSpace,
in your opinion are these raids (or any military action) capable of eliminating the Hizbullah threat? The IAF claims that it has already destroyed over 50% of HIzbullah rockets/launchers.

If they will be done right, I don't see why not.

I find it hard to believe but 2 Apaches crashed into one another.
The pilots tried to crash land the helicopters. One crash landing was successful and the other was not. One pilot got killed and the others were injured.

It happens when you fly close to one another, at night, between the hills.
Judging by the photo it looks like an A model, not a D Longbow - no radar on the top of the rotor.

Forum: F-16 News

IAF F-16I Sufa crashes Wednesday