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Irksome firm nearly ejected from Air Show - GPS jammers



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ACSheva
PostPosted: Aug 22, 2005 - 09:38 PM Reply with quote Back to top
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Irksome firm nearly ejected from Air Show

By Lyuba Pronina
Staff Writer Ivan Sekretarev / AP

ZHUKOVSKY, Moscow Region -- The jamming equipment made by Aviakonversia is so effective against U.S. planes and missiles that it apparently provoked an angry phone call to the Kremlin from U.S. President George W. Bush in the first days of the Iraq war.

Russian officials do not seem to have forgotten the scandal and on Friday tried to shut down the company's stand at the Seventh Moscow Aviation and Space Show, MAKS 2005, said Aviakonversia director Oleg Antonov.

Perhaps the company's presence was simply too embarrassing, considering that the U.S. Air Force occupied a prominent place on the tarmac, displaying a B-1B bomber, F-15 and F-16 fighters, and two bulbous tanker planes used in mid-air refueling.

Three representatives of the Federal Industry Agency and the Federal Service for Technical and Export Control, which oversees the export of defense technology, unsuccessfully attempted to close the stand on the grounds that Aviakonversia had not received clearance from the Defense Ministry to showcase its product, Antonov said.

The government representatives, concealing their ID badges, did not allow this reporter to be present during their conversation with Antonov.

"They demanded we pack up, but we have the right to be here -- we paid the rent for this stall," Antonov said after the meeting. "We have made the product using our own money and do not need the approval from the Defense Ministry, a grocery director or a banya director."

The Federal Industry Agency was unavailable for comment over the weekend.

Aviakonversia, which makes devices that jam the global positioning systems used in navigation, caused a storm of protest from Washington in the early days of the Iraq war in March 2003.

Antonov, who for 24 years worked in the State Research Institute of Aviation Systems developing defense systems for planes, founded Aviakonversia with a dozen staffers in 1992.

The company developed jammers that interfere with GPS signals and were apparently used by Iraqi forces during the U.S.-led invasion.

The Bush administration charged that Aviakonversia personnel were on the ground instructing Iraqi forces how to use and maintain the equipment, The Washington Post reported at the time.

"Our GPS jammer puts all U.S. high-precision weapons out of order," Antonov said. "They have turned billions of dollars that the U.S. government has spent into dust."

Antonov denied that his company delivered any equipment directly to Saddam Hussein but acknowledged it might have reached Iraq via arms dealers.

"Right before the war, there were a lot of people in Moscow with suitcases full of money shopping for anything that could deter U.S. troops," Antonov said.

Aviakonversia now manufactures its gear outside Russia so as not to irritate the authorities, he said, though he declined to specify where. He also refused to identify his clients, saying only that they were foreign governments that acquired the jammers through middlemen.

The German peacekeeping contingent in Afghanistan recently sent Aviakonversia a letter thanking it for the jammers, which it deployed to interfere with GPS receivers used by Taliban fighters, Antonov said.

After Aviakonversia first displayed its wares at MAKS 1997, the Pentagon acquired a few dozen jammers, Antonov said.

"Then they went quiet."

A hubbub ensued, however, in the first days of hostilities, when U.S. forces had difficulty in honing in on their targets. Bush reportedly picked up the phone to voice concern to President Vladimir Putin that Iraqi forces were using Russian-made night-vision goggles, GPS jammers and anti-tank missiles.

Antonov lamented that his company did not reap more praise back home.

A representative of state-owned Phazotron-NIIR, the maker of radars for fighter jets, also said Friday that their stand had been rigorously inspected by the export control service.

Some weapons systems -- such as the S-400 air defense system -- were not even displayed at MAKS, despite previous advertisements.

The main innovation on display at MAKS was the MiG-29OVT with all-axis thrust vector-controlled engines that allow for greater maneuverability at low speeds.

Irkut Corp. demonstrated its innovative unmanned aerial vehicles for civilian use, with the Emergency Situations Ministry likely to be its first customer.


Has anyone heard of his?

Shev
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Guysmiley
PostPosted: Aug 22, 2005 - 10:27 PM Reply with quote Back to top
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Yeah, those jammers REALLY stopped precision munitions from being used in Iraq. Three words: Home. On. Jam.
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ACSheva
PostPosted: Aug 22, 2005 - 10:44 PM Reply with quote Back to top
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Probably since Bush had to pick up the phone.

Shev
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TC
PostPosted: Aug 23, 2005 - 01:17 AM Reply with quote Back to top
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It seemed believeable until two portions of the article...

One, our GPS guided weapons performed well in Iraq.

Shock and Awe anyone?

Two, when our Prowlers flew over Iraq for the first time and zapped out the better part of the country, it took out any defenses they may have had.

Another thing: it takes a very powerful signal to override just one satellite, let alone an ARRAY of satellites. The first time they transmitted that signal, they'd be HARM fodder. Read up on "Captain Midnight" John MacDougall hacking HBO and we'll talk later.

I'm not calling anyone out here. I'm just pointing out some very questionable portions of that article.

Beers and MiGs were made to be pounded!
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ACSheva
PostPosted: Aug 23, 2005 - 03:16 AM Reply with quote Back to top
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Very true TC.

I find it hard to believe myself.
But our govt might of also lied about the performance of our GPS munitions, I mean would they say anything negative about their performance? Ofcourse they would say that it all went "well".

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TC
PostPosted: Aug 23, 2005 - 04:19 AM Reply with quote Back to top
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I dunno...I just looked at all the rubble we created and I was convinced! Razz

When our weapons go Tango Uniform, it's not the gov't that necessarily says bad things, it's the media. "Shock and Awe" pretty much clammed them up. Guess we didn't want a repeat experience with the media that we had in Kosovo.

Beers and MiGs were made to be pounded!

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swanee
PostPosted: Aug 23, 2005 - 05:33 AM Reply with quote Back to top
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Sir, we're being jammed!

Rasberry? Only one man would dare to give us the Rasberry! LONESTAR!

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parrothead
PostPosted: Aug 23, 2005 - 07:45 AM Reply with quote Back to top
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All loyalties to the US of A aside, it's just bad juju to sell such equipment to people who might deliver it into the hands of the enemy of a true world power who's looking to make war - it's a high stakes bet and I've personally watched thousands of dollars lost to the House on the turn of a card here in Vegas. The risks and rewards are great, but the risks should be weighed a bit more carefully if you ask me. Something that should never be forgotten or dismissed - the sales and the money gained are governed by the diplomacy of the country to which your citizenship is tied. That government has the power to incarcerate. They can decide by force of law that you shouldn't have done something and either put you out of business or in jail or both.

Whether or not the equipment was effective in Iraq, the sale of the equipment to people who might deliver it to Saddam was (in my opinion) a bad decision, even if it brought temporary monetary gain. Russia is not a country known for its freedoms, even today. Rights are not the same as in the US of A...

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2sBlind
PostPosted: Aug 23, 2005 - 10:30 AM Reply with quote Back to top
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"Our GPS jammer puts all U.S. high-precision weapons out of order," Antonov said. "They have turned billions of dollars that the U.S. government has spent into dust."


LMAO Must be one hell of GPS jammer to stop LGBs from hitting.... what utter BS.
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Guysmiley
PostPosted: Aug 23, 2005 - 05:10 PM Reply with quote Back to top
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I've got it! They use magic fairy dust to jam every US guided munition, the rascals! Its so simple, they just had to utilize the same "wishful thinking" technology that makes plasma stealth work!
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ACSheva
PostPosted: Aug 24, 2005 - 01:58 AM Reply with quote Back to top
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the sale of the equipment to people who might deliver it to Saddam was (in my opinion) a bad decision


Reminds me of Rumsfeld. Just proves that money is money.

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parrothead
PostPosted: Aug 24, 2005 - 03:02 AM Reply with quote Back to top
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Rumsfeld - great guy Thumb ! Thanks for the complement!

Yeah, money is money, but eventually the bad karma catches up with ya...

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TC
PostPosted: Aug 24, 2005 - 05:13 AM Reply with quote Back to top
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Remember Iran Contra.

Money can be a bad thing if it is putting an allied side's lives at risk.

Granted, we've already shot this article's credibility (or the lack thereof) full of holes, but if someone was supplying equipment to help an illegal Baghdad regime fight against allied forces, then they need to pay for it.

The Russians and the French need to start taking a good, hard look at who they are supplying military equipment to. Sacrificing your morals or good judgment for the Almighty Euro or Ruble will wind up biting you in the @$$ in the long run.

Of course, we haven't always made the best decisions to that end either, but we're pretty good about self-policing, and we can always suspend trade relations (note Cuba and Iran, among others).

Beers and MiGs were made to be pounded!
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ACSheva
PostPosted: Aug 24, 2005 - 05:30 AM Reply with quote Back to top
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Quote:
but if someone was supplying equipment to help an illegal Baghdad regime fight against allied forces, then they need to pay for it.


TC I agree 100%.

Now look at it from the Soviets side back in 1980s when we were providing stingers/training to Bin Laden. And look at the result. Our own choppers were targeted by our own missiles back in 03, and etc. I just think that providing Russian/French military equip to some current nations is just awfull, and we US are guilty of that also. But remember $ is $.

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TC
PostPosted: Aug 24, 2005 - 05:46 AM Reply with quote Back to top
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A couple of things:

We were supplying Stingers to the Mujahideen, not just Bin Laden in particular. Also, at that time, Bin Laden was an ally, as were the Afghani rebels.

By OEF, those stockpiled Stingers were nearly 20 years old, and had not had proper upkeep since '89. They were well past their operational life, and none of our choppers were shot down by one. Missiles, like aircraft also have to be properly maintained.

Our choppers that were shot down (including the Chinook that my friend was unfortunately flying) were shot down by Russian-built RPGs, and small arms fire.

Our aid to the Mujahideen to fight the Soviets was, no doubt in large part, a response to the Soviets' aid to the Vietnamese (whether they choose to own up to it or not). Paybacks can be a real...

Beers and MiGs were made to be pounded!
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