Forum: F-22A Raptor

I don't suppose anyone here is from the 43rd FS at Tyndall. Also, would anyone know when the 27th FS will stand it's first F-22s up? I'm due to PCS to Langley and look forward to seeing them. Also, I think it should be known that in my experience (I've had the privilege of being in a dogfight with a pair of F-22s while TDY at Tyndall) that while the Raptor may defeat any aircraft based on specs and abilities, it matters alot to the pilot skill. Too many people are denying the respect and capabilities that foreign pilots have. I was in an F-15D that defeated the F-22s twice in a total of 6 engagements. It can be done.

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I was at the 43rd for a while after I left the 31st at Edwards. I'm at the 27th now. We are currently flying some loaners to Tyndall. Also, keep in mind that when we fly against the 15's, there are some *serious* limitations that are set on us to keep things fair against the 15 guys. Suffice to say, if those limitations were removed, the 15's would get walked all over before they knew anyone was in the airspace.

Quote:

I was in an F-15D that defeated the F-22s twice in a total of 6 engagements.

What type of fight?

Define "defeated."

Who were you flying with?

The 27th is supposed to be IOC in December but they won't have many of their own airplanes. They will still have a few loaners from Tyndall.

I was flying an F-15D from the 2nd FS with Captain Cabral from the 43rd. At the time he was training to be a IP for the Raptor and the scenario consisted of only visual engagements. A four ship sortie with the two F-22 fighting only one F-15 at a time. We managed to get a gun kill after an aggressive tailslide dropped us right behind one of the F-22s and then we got a Sidewinder kill at about 2,500 yards. Originally supposed to be 8 or ten engaements, our jet started bleeding from the right horizontal stabilizer so we had to knock it off. I understand the fact that the F-22s could have picked us off at the edge of the AMRAAM engagement envelope, but I was still happy to get kills on a Raptor. Not every day you get to pull 8 Gs with an F-22.

Like I said, *serious* limitations when we fly against legacy aircraft.

In BVR engagement, the F-15 almost has no chance.

However, in the WVR dogfight, the number of fighter (the more the better), the size of fighter (the smaller the better), and the training and skill of pilot should be the most important factors...

It seems that there were still some limitations for the flight envelop and G-limit of the F/A-22's FCS last year. Have these limitations been removed now?

The flight envelope is continuing to expand each day. As long as 4002 keeps flying.....

Forum Veteran Joined: Apr 16, 2005 - 03:16 PM Posts: 800

The F-15s pilots have the advantage that they've been flying their aircraft for many years.

Viperalltheway wrote:

The F-15s pilots have the advantage that they've been flying their aircraft for many years.

Regardless, the 15's are still bringing a knife to a gunfight.

Forum Veteran Joined: Apr 16, 2005 - 03:16 PM Posts: 800

Against anything non stealthy they can still be effective..

However, I'd like to see a comparison between them and new F-16s. My guess is that they would be about equivalent in a/a while the F-16 is much more versatile for a/g. Given also their high cost of maintenance now, replacing them with new vipers may not be a bad idea.

Quote:

I was flying an F-15D from the 2nd FS with Captain Cabral from the 43rd. At the time he was training to be a IP for the Raptor and the scenario consisted of only visual engagements. A four ship sortie with the two F-22 fighting only one F-15 at a time. We managed to get a gun kill after an aggressive tailslide dropped us right behind one of the F-22s and then we got a Sidewinder kill at about 2,500 yards. Originally supposed to be 8 or ten engaements, our jet started bleeding from the right horizontal stabilizer so we had to knock it off. I understand the fact that the F-22s could have picked us off at the edge of the AMRAAM engagement envelope, but I was still happy to get kills on a Raptor. Not every day you get to pull 8 Gs with an F-22.

Woah... tailsliding on an F-15. Cool!!!

Enthusiast Joined: May 21, 2005 - 04:12 PM Posts: 21

RaptorKiller wrote:

I was flying an F-15D from the 2nd FS with Captain Cabral from the 43rd. At the time he was training to be a IP for the Raptor and the scenario consisted of only visual engagements. A four ship sortie with the two F-22 fighting only one F-15 at a time. We managed to get a gun kill after an aggressive tailslide dropped us right behind one of the F-22s and then we got a Sidewinder kill at about 2,500 yards. Originally supposed to be 8 or ten engaements, our jet started bleeding from the right horizontal stabilizer so we had to knock it off. I understand the fact that the F-22s could have picked us off at the edge of the AMRAAM engagement envelope, but I was still happy to get kills on a Raptor. Not every day you get to pull 8 Gs with an F-22.

Wow. I'll have to ask Waco about that. A tracking kill, a heater kill, and an EP all in one mission. That one must stand out in his mind.

Regards,
Murph

Murph,

Quote:

I'll have to ask Waco about that. A tracking kill, a heater kill, and an EP all in one mission.

Don't bother asking because it never happened. Embarassed

I guess the rule requiring 10% of the story to be true applies in this forum as well. Hmmm, I wonder what 10% of "Raptorkiller's" story is true. I guess it must be the part about there being F-15s and F-22s stationed at Tyndall!

Hahahahaha, fair enough, fair enough, you don't have to believe me, I'm not one to imbelish, but hey, that's the community I live in

RaptorKiller wrote:

I was in an F-15D that defeated the F-22s twice in a total of 6 engagements. It can be done.

Personally, I think there is a lot of truth in both stories. Remember "Cope India" and how the ROE's affected the apparent outcome. Once the ROE's were explained, it all made sense. An interesting article from Av Leak -enjoy URL;
www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1237790/posts

Adrian

Forum: F-22A Raptor

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