Forum: Rotary Wing Aircraft

How good is the Apache really? I heard that it had many doubts after Kosovo but it reaffirmed that it is still the best in Iraq and Afganistan.

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The Apache is just like any other helicopter. It is awesome and second to none when it is flying at 100%. However, the Apache never seems to be @ 100%. Much to say for the USAF MH-53 J/M Paves. For heavy strikes, the Apache is still tops. For tactical missions, I'd prefer the smaller AH-1Z Super Cobra.

But how good is the Apache really? What makes it the best aside from having the Longbow system and hellfire missiles?

The Apache is a extremely manueverable helicopter being one of the few that can carry the amount of firepower it does and still do barrel rolls and loops. The Apache is pretty fast with a top speed somewhere over 150kts with a full load. The Apaches have a swept back rotor tip like the Blackhawks which allows for greater manueverability and dramatically reduces it's noise. For the attack mission it does very well. One shortfall of the Apache is it's INS. There is no GPS guidance (at least in earlier models). Considering the Hellfire needs such coordinates to be accurate, this is a bad thing. During the first Gulf War, two-ships of MH-53J Pavelows had to lead the Apaches to the radar sites and let them know where they were so they could program their missiles. Overall, they are very maintenance friendly as is the Blackhawk. I'm sure your new Apaches have many upgrades that I don't know about. Hope this helps.

Elite 1K Joined: May 26, 2005 - 08:39 PM Posts: 1496

Hellfires don't need GPS-precise position information to be accurate. They are laser guided and home to a laser spot. They can be locked on before or after launch, but don't care where they are, except in relation to the launching Apache. So if the Apache doesn't know exactly where it is, the missile could care less, because the missile knows where it was when it was launched, and as long as it sees a laser spot its happy.

The Longbow Hellfire is guided by a MMW radar, and again, could care less where it is in a larger sense, all it cares about is where the target is in relation to it.

The Apache is considered the best attack helicopter in the world. The Apache has a modern electronic systems, like the TADS and the PNVS, with a FLIR and a laser pod to guide the Hellfire misiles. The Hellfire misiles are the best air to ground helicopter misiles, and can destroy everytank and vehicle.

The new AH-64D Apache longbow has a longbow radar taht can see 12 enemy objetives, and clasificate they in 6 kinds of vehicles (tanks, AAA, SAM, etc...). Also this radar can guide the Hellfire, so then this misile are now fire & forget.

However, the Aapche is consider little maneuverable, if we compare this helicopter with the european Tiger or the Cobra.

Elite 1K Joined: May 26, 2005 - 08:39 PM Posts: 1496

Right, the Apache is less agile than a Cobra or Tiger, no question. But neither of those can tote around 16 Hellfires either. They were designed with different objectives in mind.

Forum Veteran Joined: Nov 07, 2003 - 09:12 PM Posts: 901

Guysmiley wrote:

Right, the Apache is less agile than a Cobra or Tiger, no question. But neither of those can tote around 16 Hellfires either. They were designed with different objectives in mind.

Guysmiley, I believe AH-1Z is 16-Hellfires capable.

cheers,

Elite 1K Joined: May 26, 2005 - 08:39 PM Posts: 1496

Wow, you're right. Those are some seriously beefed up stub wings! But I bet with 16 Hellfires hanging off of it its about as agile as an Apache. Smile

The AH-1Z can carry 16 hellfire misiles and 2 sidewinders. Poke

I talked with an Apache driver at an airshow recentley who said he would give his left you-know-what to be driving a Cobra Zulu.

ptplauthor wrote:

Of all the tankbusters, I think I'd rather have some Frogfoots in my Air Force.

Why the Su-25 Frogfoot?

Oh, its R-195 turbojets are multi-fuel!

Why not try the Mi-28N Havoc?

From what I've been told, the Frogfoot's capable of supersonic speeds. It's got a flush in survivability--the Havoc's only got a three-of-a-kind.

The Havoc is a Helicopter, and in CAS, as in many a mission involving airplanes, speed is life. Stopping on a dime just makes you that much MORE vulnerable to ground fire.

The ONLY chopper I'd wanna fly in combat would be the HIND--only because it thinks its a plane--fast speed and it can actually drop bombs--FTW.

ptplauthor wrote:

Stopping on a dime just makes you that much MORE vulnerable to ground fire.

From RPGs and MANPADs, yes, but small arms fire is nothing.

The Havoc is a Russian Apache.

In several years time, the Indians will have their indigenous attack helo, and it's gonna be better than the Apache Longbow but close to the Comanche.

http://www.f-16.net/f-16_forum_viewtopic-t-12311.html

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From RPGs and MANPADs, yes, but small arms fire is nothing.

YGBSM. <<<can we get an emoticon for this?

Please kindly explain how a helicopter that can survive a rocket-propelled anti-tank grenade can be taken down by 7.62 ammunition?????

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The Havoc is a Russian Apache.

I mean this in the kindest way possible.....NO SH!T????? I never would have guessed that.

Quote:

In several years time, the Indians will have their indigenous attack helo, and it's gonna be better than the Apache Longbow but close to the Comanche.

That's right---in SEVERAL years, and it's only a "Light" helicopter. It still doesn't matter what YOUR opinion is, find me something from Jane's, GS, or FAS to hang my hat on, and I MIGHT believe you.

On a side note--does anyone else think the Havoc looks like Goofy or Wile E. Coyote from an angle?? Was "Hound" already taken?