Forum: General F-35 Forum

Nifty. Any chance of export?

F-16.net Sponsor

There is always the chance of export. The problem is the Not Developed Here syndrome.

We should do a swap, Spike NLOS for more F-35s.

Well, we need something to put into those VLS stations on the LCSs.

This is what drives me crazy.. they are developing a puny Griffin (with abysmal range) as an "interim" solution when the Spike NLOS is battle proven and has been navalized.

Oddly enough, the Griffin is apparently going to be taking slots in the RAM rack instead of the VLS bay.

Great, now they want to reduce the RAM loadout to put in the anemic Griffin...

In case you are wondering, here is my ideas on upgunning LCS with today's tech.

1. Put Spike NLOS in the VLS bay up front
2. Replace the 30mm slow a$$ cannons with armored Hellfire box launchers (see photo below). Hellfires can be swapped out for a four-pack of LOGIR/APKWS 2.75inch rockets.
3. Put 35mm fast-firing Millenium guns on the hanger corners since they have no through-deck issues (again, see photo)
4. Put cart-mounted Harpoon or NSM missiles in the rear mission bay that can be brought out as needed.
5. Replace the .50 cal pidle MGs with mk41 remote turrets sporting the same m230 that the Apache has.

The plan

The Hellfire turrets

The Millenium Gun

The mk41

The Spike NLOS

IIRC the cancelled NLOS was a tad ad more,sophisticated than the Israeli Spike, allowing autonomous targeting and even a loitering capability in the LAM variant. Perhaps the complexity was at the root of the problems which eventually led to it's cancellation.

Get it in now and upgrade later.....

Auto targeting may be important in land warfare, but not so much in sea based warfare.

The Spike NLOS is = PAM and who knows, they might come out with a LAM later.

Getting back On Topic

Having a system for ground troops to be able to see what the F-35 sees as it flies overhead, and the ability to use that information to target their own non-line-of-sight weapons, would probably be a life saver.

There are FAC devices either in testing or being developed which will allow the Ground FAC and the F-35 pilot to see the same overall picture. The FAC will designate the target or vice versa so that target is confirmed by both seeing the same picture. I'll guess this system could be used as suggested by 'count_to_10'. Unfortunately the URL to this info has been lost for the moment. USMC like to be independent if possible so not only would the suggested FAC/F-35 comms be useful but also this STUAS.

New expeditionary UAV takes off from China Lake, sans runway 11 Sep 2012

http://www.navair.navy.mil/index.cfm?fu ... mp;id=5120

"NAVAL AIR SYSTEMS COMMAND, PATUXENT RIVER, Md. – The Navy successfully launched its newest small unmanned aircraft without using a runway Sept. 10 at Naval Air Weapons Station China Lake, Calif.

A little more than two years into its engineering, manufacturing and development phase, the RQ-21A Small Tactical Unmanned Air System (STUAS) entered developmental test at China Lake, beginning with a 66-minute flight Monday.

During the initial developmental flight test at the weapons station, operators flew the RQ-21A using a unique pneumatic launcher and a recovery system known as Skyhook. This system, developed by Insitu, Inc., eliminates the need for runways and enables a safe recovery and expeditionary capability for tactical missions on land or sea.

“The flight at China Lake marks the start of a new test phase for RQ-21A STUAS, the first expeditionary, multi-intelligence UAS in its class,” said Col. Jim Rector, STUAS program manager (PMA-263) at Patuxent River, Md. “Developmental test will be fast-paced, like the rest of the program has been. We are on track for initial operational capability in 2013.”

Sailors and Marines from from Air Test and Evaluation Squadron (VX) 30 at China Lake are not the first to experience the expeditionary “no runway” solution. Three hours southeast of the base, Marines at Twentynine Palms are already training with an RQ-21A Early Operational Capability (EOC) system. The CONUS-based deployment allows the Navy and Marines to train units and operators, collect additional performance data and identify opportunities to expand the flight envelope.

“Marines are getting experience on how to operate and use the system while our team is collecting valuable data,” Rector said. “Lessons learned from this deployment will be directly applied to the program of record. EOC helps us mitigate and evaluate risks early on.”

While both RQ-21A variants are similar to operate, the RQ-21A STUAS is more robust. RQ-21A EOC uses long-wave infrared (LWIR) camera, which will be replaced with mid-wave infrared (MWIR) camera for production. The upgraded variant also adds enhanced features for operational security and an automatic identification system for maritime missions.

RQ-21A provides expanded payload capacity and rapid payload integration so that the warfighter can use the most advanced, and relevant, payload for their unique land and maritime missions and counter-warfare actions. The platform provides persistent maritime and land-based tactical Reconnaissance, Surveillance, and Target Acquisition (RSTA) data collection and dissemination capabilities to the warfighter."

http://www.navair.navy.mil/img/uploads/ ... uncher.jpg

"Navy and Insitu personnel lift the RQ-21A Small Tacticall Unmanned Aircraft System(STUAS)onto launcher in prepartion for flight at Naval Air Station China Lake, Calif. Sept. 10. (U.S. Navy Photo)"

count_to_10 wrote:

Getting back On Topic

Having a system for ground troops to be able to see what the F-35 sees as it flies overhead, and the ability to use that information to target their own non-line-of-sight weapons, would probably be a life saver.

I'd read on,another forum,where this is being taken a step further where troops will actually use an,aircraft's sensors for targeting and control the release of ordnance via a Rover type of,device.,Pilots may not be too,thrilled being demoted to being drivers but at least UAVs don't have egos, at least not yet. Very Happy

I still like the idea of ground forces deploying small VLS tubes.

[quote="spazsinbad"]....RQ-21A provides expanded payload capacity and rapid payload integration so that the warfighter can use the most advanced, and relevant, payload for their unique land and maritime missions and counter-warfare actions. The platform provides persistent maritime and land-based tactical Reconnaissance, Surveillance, and Target Acquisition (RSTA) data collection and dissemination capabilities to the warfighter."...quote]

Boeing 16' wingspan 24 hr ops. formerly known by some as upgraded Scan Eagle.

count_to_10 wrote:

I still like the idea of ground forces deploying small VLS tubes.

The VLS in 20' containers is still popular and is to be tested for the FCS if the Griffin fizzles. Griffin 13 lb. warhead; NLOS; 15 lb. warhead; 25 mi. range and 150 in a 20' shipping container. Very Happy

HERE is the iPAD from HELL!

iPads Now Helping Marines Unleash Hell By Mark Riffee, September 16, 2011

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2011/09 ... n-an-ipad/

"When Marines are in a firefight in Afghanistan and need back up, they call in helicopters to blast the enemy from the sky. Sounds simple enough, but it’s not — according to current standard operating procedures for close-air strikes, ground troops radio coordinates to a pilot who then has to rifle through 60 to 80 pounds of maps to find the building he’s supposed to hit. Radio signals cut out, coordinates get jumbled and, even with half a grown man’s weight in maps in the cockpit, sometimes the pilot doesn’t have a detailed image of the target area. But this may all change soon.

The Marines recently took a baby step towards a more efficient future when the 3rd Aircraft Wing bought 32 iPads. The total purchase — not quite $20,000 worth of tablets and accessories, according to Defense News — was merely “a hiccup in the grand scheme of defense spending,” a former deputy G-3 for operations pointed out. But it could be a crucial advance in aerial warfare.

Capt. Jim Carlson, a Cobra pilot in a Marine Light Attack Helicopter Squadron (HMLA), is responsible for piquing the interest of his higher-ups. He was annoyed with the current communication system so he decided to mess around with his personal iPad, which he discovered could be digitally linked to troops on the ground. All 80 cartographical pounds could be easily uploaded to the device and manipulated like any other map app — broad area maps hyperlinked to detailed sections.

The brass was wary when they first heard what Carlson and his fellow pilots were up to at Camp Bastion in Helmand province. They weren’t sure if a commercial product was secure enough to handle in-combat transmissions (though only non-classified maps were being stored on the devices). But about a year later, the brass appears to be on-board — at least on a trial-basis — and the commanding officer of HMLA-267 told Defense News that iPads have sped up communications by about 15 minutes during close-air missions. Now ground and air can simply confirm they are fingering the same building on their tablet and fire...."

Report a year old and only small steps but youse get the picture?

http://www.wired.com/images_blogs/dange ... Marine.png

Forum: General F-35 Forum

Flying iPhone from HELL