QF-16

darkvarkguy · by **darkvarkguy** » 13 Dec 2009, 16:57

In searching this site, it has been several years since this topic came up. I read in an article today that QF-16s will replace the QF-4s starting in 2012. Any new news on this and will they be J79 equipped as was thought previously? Block 15/20? AMARC refurbs or airframes retired right into 'Q' status?

That_Engine_Guy · by **That_Engine_Guy** » 13 Dec 2009, 17:34

I've never seen a proposal to use J79 engines; there are plenty of F100-PW-200 motors for use in the QF-16s. With the inclusion of the Block 30 aircraft, they will most likely use old F110-GE-100s or convert the aircraft to use F100s (Easier IMO than using a J79)

Converting airframes for different engines would be something so expensive it would have been included in the contract proposal(s). There are many documents and I haven't read all of them.

Here is the actual wording in the contract from: https://www.fbo.gov/index?tab=documents ... bmode=list

Non-recurring Engineering (NRE) and related support for design, development/integration, build/procurement, and test of a drone-peculiar equipment (DPE) package and installation modification for conversion of F-16 aircraft to QF-16 FSATs and related special test equipment (STE)/drone peculiar support equipment (PSE) in accordance with (IAW) Section C. Contractor-developed DPE/STE/PSE hardware requirements that are deliverable are as follows:

Modification of two (2) each Blk-15/-25/-30 F-16 aircraft into prototype QF-16 test beds.

Procurement/development of special test equipment (STE)/drone-peculiar support equipment (PSE).

One (1) each composite set intermediate/depot-level STE required in- the-factory [to include applicable vendor(s)/sub-contractor(s) items] to support DPE production and production support as determined by Contractor.

Two (2) each sets organizational-level PSE for in-factory use [system-level end-to-end checkout/acceptance test procedure (ATP)/pre-mission test procedure (PMT) and portable flight-line test set].

QF-16 test bed and STE/PSE acceptance will be deferred IAW EGLIN-H006.

All STE/PSE procured/developed during the Pre-System Design and development (pre-SDD) contract phase will be delivered in-place at the end of SDD contract phase for Contractor use for the duration of the contract with final acceptance by/delivery to the Government at the end of the contract.

Keep 'em flyin' :thumb:

TEG

darkvarkguy · by **darkvarkguy** » 13 Dec 2009, 18:55

Yeah the J79 didn't seem to make any sense to me. The only reason I mentioned it was in doing a search here, a thread from 2006 spoke of it at length. Thanks for the link TEG. No time frame given though. I'm not sure how many QF-4s they have left.

That_Engine_Guy · by **That_Engine_Guy** » 13 Dec 2009, 19:41

darkvarkguy wrote:Yeah the J79 didn't seem to make any sense to me. The only reason I mentioned it was in doing a search here, a thread from 2006 spoke of it at length. Thanks for the link TEG. No time frame given though. I'm not sure how many QF-4s they have left.

That is a good point you made; how many flyable F-4s are left?

Without 'donor' F-4s to supply the J79s where would you get them? I don' think they are still in production, but why would you purchase brand new engines to simply use them as targets?!?

:2c:

Much easier to get the PW-200s back in flyable condition for Target Vipers. PW-100s out of the old F-15s would work too, unless they have plans for QF-15As too?

TEG

VprWzl · by **VprWzl** » 14 Dec 2009, 01:10

QF-15s would be too expensive. At least that's the word on the street.

That_Engine_Guy · by **That_Engine_Guy** » 14 Dec 2009, 02:31

An MQF-15A would make an AWESOME bomb truck in any AOR! :twisted:

TEG

bandit66 · by **bandit66** » 14 Dec 2009, 02:56

Supposedly they have enough F-4's to operate thru 2014. QF-16's will be up and running by then but in very small numbers as test aircraft.

tbarlow · by **tbarlow** » 14 Dec 2009, 04:36

That is going to be a sad day when the "Q's" start flying.

But on the other hand, I know there are a few tail numbers some
people would like to see end up in the drink...

Roscoe · by **Roscoe** » 14 Dec 2009, 04:41

Better go down in flames than to rust away in the desert...

That_Engine_Guy · by **That_Engine_Guy** » 14 Dec 2009, 05:14

After seeing the Civilian SU-27s on the open market at $5M each, you'd think the USAF would see the $$ and wake up!

If they could sell just 25 F-16As at $4M each, (Versus letting them rot, blasting them to bits, or selling them for scrap aluminum) that would be $100M they could use for safety upgrades and fixes to existing Vipers~!

TEG

bjr1028 · by **bjr1028** » 14 Dec 2009, 16:21

That_Engine_Guy wrote:After seeing the Civilian SU-27s on the open market at $5M each, you'd think the USAF would see the $$ and wake up!

If they could sell just 25 F-16As at $4M each, (Versus letting them rot, blasting them to bits, or selling them for scrap aluminum) that would be $100M they could use for safety upgrades and fixes to existing Vipers~!

TEG

Warbirds do make their way into civilian hands. Besides, simulations can only go so far. The only way to know if the missile actually works to test it on a real aircraft.

gosmack · by **gosmack** » 15 Dec 2009, 03:52

That_Engine_Guy wrote:After seeing the Civilian SU-27s on the open market at $5M each, you'd think the USAF would see the $$ and wake up!

If they could sell just 25 F-16As at $4M each, (Versus letting them rot, blasting them to bits, or selling them for scrap aluminum) that would be $100M they could use for safety upgrades and fixes to existing Vipers~!

TEG

One could only hope that a number of F-16's would be made available as warbirds. Affording them on the other hand could present a problem. However if I had the money available, I would be all over it.

MechFromHell · by **MechFromHell** » 15 Dec 2009, 21:39

Who actually operates and performs modifications to the "Q" series aircraft? Is it an Air Force function withn Material Command or is it contracted like nearly everything else?

discofishing · by **discofishing** » 15 Dec 2009, 23:04

I say we save as many Phantoms as we can and immediately start blowing up F-16s. ;-)

MechFromHell · by **MechFromHell** » 16 Dec 2009, 02:36

I was starting to wonder how long it was going to take to get a comment like that from one of the old Phantom guys! Good call!