Forum: General

Im halfway through an engrossing Ebook about the F-15E's in Desert Storm, and had a question you guys could enlighten me with.

At what point is the decision made to abort a strike on a target due to SAM activity? Do you fly into the target with bombs and fuel tanks if you only have, say, one or two launch warnings, or do you abort if even one missile tracks your aircraft?

If answering this question reveals classified info ill respect that, but im curious as one incident in the book has a 4-ship flight of Mudhens targeting a SCUD site, and the first two aircraft evade the SAM's and drop their bombs, while the last two aircraft drop tanks, evade the SAM's targeted to them, and abort the strike.

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Elite 1K Joined: May 26, 2005 - 08:39 PM Posts: 1496

You're not going to get real answers to questions about current tactics here from people who actually know.

I think the answer would depend on a great number of things. Jamming support? Wild weasels? Did the second pair end up in a less advantagous position with respect to energy or altitude after evading SAM launches? Are there SAM sites closer to their targets than the first pair?

I'm guessing in reality it comes down to what the element lead decides to do...

If it's the same book I have at home, there's another book printed about the same time that's about the A-10 and stories from the guys who flew it in D.S. Has about the same story line where the guys are here in the US watching the news thinking "will we go?" then theres some harrowing stories about the flight over the Atlantic, then all the stories about the actual war and how the A-10 was tasked to do EVERYTHING and then some. It's as great a read as the F-15E book.
Is your F-15E book the same one where they describe in pretty good detail how the F-15E's radar takes a 'picture' then waits a few miles and takes another 'picture' off boresight so the radar can form a 3D picture of the target area?

I have those books in my personal library, they are great! Cool

As for SAMs- they make for some pretty unique flight patterns by their targets and any other friends with said aircraft. SAMs don't play well with others, you know. Confused

You may have seen it before but this 10 min video may answer some of your questions or simply entertain you, i'm sure i hear a "jettison stores" call but am not sure. I'm pretty sure they did jettison looking and hearing the G's they're pulling.
Maybe some fo the real experts could enlighten us on what was going on in this intense situation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2uh4yMAx ... re=related

Stroke 3 drops his bombs on his target at 4:17 into the YouTube video. Applause

Once you start your final target run from IP to TGT there are a couple of different actions that you can take. Depending on the threat and time to release you may continue the attack or abort. The specific ranges at which you would do this are threat specific. Jettisoning the stores is definately an action that might be taken but if this happens then the enemy has won that specific battle. In regards to the you tube video the pilots are doing a specific manuever to break the radar lock of the SAM site. Even inside a threat envelope you can survive if a missle cant guide. The goal is to delay SAM radar lock until weapons are away or SEAD support can target the threat.

Salute!

Some things never change.

The ROE can hinder an attack, but I can't recall a real world mission that the strike force aborted due to SAM's and AAA and Migs. That's a large strike force, not the kind that the F-117's flew in 'raqi I.

Hell, we have the Weasels, decoys and MIGCAP and other stuff to reduce or degrade the air defenses. Sooner or later you gotta bite the bullet and hang it out.

The new missiles are great, but they still can't see thru hills and mountains. So sometimes a very low alt approach can reduce losses. 'course, then you're in the AAA zone. Unlike Viet Nam, nobody the USAF or Israelis have faced since 1972 has had anything like the North Vee's AAA gunners or quantity of guns.THOSE GUYS WERE GOOD!!!!

The simple answer is : you have supporting players, you have your own jammers and such, and you don't stay predictable. We prolly lost our only jet in El Dorado Canyon because the 'vark crew was so scared of the SAM's that they hit the ground staying too low. But we don't really know.

Gums sends ...

Gums wrote:

We prolly lost our only jet in El Dorado Canyon because the 'vark crew was so scared of the SAM's that they hit the ground staying too low. Gums sends ...

FOUL!
Wing Sweepers were never scared!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_TEOsxiCXE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FcVdUNp95cc

Forum: General

SAM engagement Question?