Forum: F-35 Lightning II

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But put in the context of a timeline, all the "whizbang" avionics of the F-35 is relevant as is its LO signature.

True, but don't get so caught up on all the whiz-bang gizmos on the jet as
they will require significant time and further operational testing to become
mature enough to deliver on promises. Don't forget, new Gen 4.5 can
achieve some or perhaps even a lot of the whiz-bang SA entities of the
jet, since minituratization in electronics waits for NO MAN. That's like
saying that we cannot build a new radar that is more capable than the
AN/APG-81 as used on the current F-35.

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But I would STILL rather go to war in an F-35 than anything else if I were to face any of those systems. I would much rather be in an F-35 than in the Su-35 that will face it.

Honestly, I would rather not go to war in either of them, since war rarely
ever really solves any problems and is a waste of time/money and human life. Granted, there have been some wars that have been unavoidable.

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But fortunately we will be doing the same, and when/if Russia/other adversaries (PRC?) finally fields that thing, they'll be faced with the fruits of our efforts to develop new block-upgraded F-35's, JRADM, AIM-120D, directed energy weapons, stealthy UAV's, etc.

But, at what cost? How much money do we (US) need to spend in order to be
the world's police force? How much to throw our weight around in the world
and tick-off other nation states, whether they are right or wrong? Many
nations get by, by having a strong defensive force making invasion of them
an unattractive option by a potential aggressor. As far as taking on China,
all they would need to do is to stop making our goods from their factories
and stop floating debt to us. No Raptor will ever be able to defeat that.
As far as the "mythical" Pak-FA is concerned, in a sense, they already won.
How? We only got 187 Raptors and they did not spend the billions like we
did to develop it. In a sense, they have their leisure in stamping out as
many SU-XX as they want (numbers game) if they have the money and the
interest (financially) to do it. Make no mistake, no country, not even the USA wants to take on the "motherland" (Russia or FSU), since they potentially could resort to nuclear weapons and they have more than anyone
and might resort to them if their conventional forces are in disarray.

Lastly, as far as the F-35 is concerned, it should shape up to be a capable
platform, but right now, it is extremely risky. Why? It is the most ex-
pensive and ambitious fighter program in history and it promises a whole
lot, like being economical, robust, easy to maintain, modular, potent etc...
Sounds great, where do I sign up! But, by the way, can I see some of this
stuff in action, like the cost per plane, the stealth, the sensors and
avionics says the potential buyer. Granted, they are still developing it,
but this program runs the risk of spiraling out of control in regards to
cost. I will feel more comfortable after we have at least half of the test
flights done and it is delivering on all of these marvelous promises.
"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence". The rest is
"35 Boyz... talk".

F-16.net Sponsor

Agreed on much of what you've said, especially with regards to the philosophical direction in which some of this is heading. Of course I hope that the war/battle that F-22/F-35 were designed for never occurs. And yes for every step we make, our potential adversaries are also making their own advances, and developmental costs imposed by one side upon the other by the perceived need are a weapon in their own right. I'd even concede as an F-22 fan that we've created a wonder weapon in the F-22 to which the other side has no direct answer, and to which the other side may have not needed to answer heretofore.

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As far as the "mythical" Pak-FA is concerned, in a sense, they already won. How? We only got 187 Raptors and they did not spend the billions like we did to develop it.

However, with regards to the above, I am sure that Russian and Chinese strategists (or insert potential adversary here) are elbowing themselves and chuckling and saying, "look how much the Americans have been forced to spend!". But I doubt that anyone considering crossing the Taiwan strait or re-taking a former Warsaw Pact nation from NATO would be smiling. If that's their victory, I'll take America's "defeat" of having its expensive silver bullet force of F-22's that stand ready today to support and defend our interests and those of our allies, and the hordes of F-35's coming in the near future. I would sure as heck NOT want to be either the Su-27, J-11 or MiG 29 pilot going up against those F-22's that we have today, or the general that has to plan against them.

Forum: F-35 Lightning II

F-35C "Lightning" II