Forum: F-22A Raptor

Hypothetically speaking, how difficult would it be for a pilot flying an F-22 to defect to another country? Would the United States military be able to successfully intercept it before it landed in said country? I'm sure the distance would matter, but let us assume that the Raptor could indeed make it on whatever amount of fuel it had.

Or rather than a United States citizen defecting to another country, what if a secret agent from another country were somehow able to hide his agenda and become an F-22 pilot, thus enabling him to (possibly) fly the F-22 to his original country?

The reason I ask this is due to a similar event that occured with a MiG-25 and Victor Belenko: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viktor_Belenko

In the event that such a thing did indeed occur, and the F-22 was successfully delivered to the opposing country, what would the United States do about it? Would they demand its return? Attempt to destroy it in a bombing run? Surely the United States would go to great lengths to prevent an F-22 from falling into enemy hands.

Also, how much use would an F-22 be to an enemy country? Could they successfully back-engineer it?

F-16.net Sponsor

Now that's thinking outside the box. But worth thinking about for sure. Fair point. Perhaps the biggest loss would be mostly loss of face? Such a scenario could have gone down with a B-2 too? Or F-117 back in the day?

Perhaps US should just get it over with and flat out make a deal to swap 1 F-22 for one SU-35BM and one PaK-FA? Very Happy

When was the last time a U.S. aircraft defected to another country?

Quote:

When was the last time a U.S. aircraft defected to another country?

This is hypothetical. Plus, I mentioned the possibility of a spy stealing the aircraft (as opposed to a defection).

Lets just hope that the Air Force screens pilots and personnel involved very well Smile

I find it very unlikely though but nevertheless not impossible. As for a US response to such a fact taking place... well I certainly would not like to be the guy/girl who has to make that decision.

Anyway... hard to say I guess. The last time a USAF driver went unstable I think was in an A-10 when the guy broke off from the flight during a training mission with live weapons in the U.S. and flew quite a ways and committed suicide.

http://www.cnn.com/US/9710/24/a10.crash/index.html

Quote:

Lets just hope that the Air Force screens pilots and personnel involved very well I find it very unlikely though but nevertheless not impossible. As for a US response to such a fact taking place... well I certainly would not like to be the guy/girl who has to make that decision.

Can ground-based radars detect a Raptor, though? Could other Raptor's shoot it down?

Quote:

Anyway... hard to say I guess. The last time a USAF driver went unstable I think was in an A-10 when the guy broke off from the flight during a training mission with live weapons in the U.S. and flew quite a ways and committed suicide.

http://www.cnn.com/US/9710/24/a10.crash/index.html

Interesting story, but how does something like "spontaneous" suicide occur?

I guess I should also ask if immigrants are allowed to become U.S. military pilots? Would it be suspicious at all if someone originally from Iran wanted to become an F-22 pilot? I'm pretty sure that the Raptor couldn't fly from the U.S. to Iran without running out of fuel, but has the Raptor ever been deployed to bases outside of the U.S. (and closer to enemy territory)?

I remember hearing years ago that a 117 pilot also committed suicide in his airplane. I can't find anything to prove it though and there has only been 3 F-117 crashes that resulted in fatalities. The way I heard it, the pilot had a pregnant wife at home and found out that it wasn't his. If anyone has inputs on this, I would be interested.

On the F-22 note, I am sure our pilots could make it from Alaska to somewhere in eastern Russia, but you have to remember that all USAF pilots are heavily screened and have to maintain a top secret clearance. For a foreign spy to do it would take about 20 years of pre-planning (starting around 8 years old to make the cut off for UPT). Bribery would be an easier way to get one, but finances are one of the things federal investigators scrutinize for a DOD clearance. Pretty unrealistic overall, but the huge worry is industrial espionage. How tempting is a 100k for a guy working down in marietta to carry something out past security?

First this is the United States of America not russia. People give their lives trying to get into this country so I highly doubt a sane person would try to "defect." That being said the screening process to fly an F-22 im sure is very thorough not just on a physical standpoint but also on a phsycological basis. I know there was an a-10 pilot that put his jet into a mountain but I think that was somewhere CONUS (maybe colorado) I also heard rumors about another A-10 pilot doing the same in korea around 2003-2004. I might have been just a rumor but I do tend to remember hearing something of this sort. but other than that, that is a good question that I don't think you will know the answer to until someone defects with a jet.

Odd...I've never heard of a single fatality out of a 117...

Awful lot of "What ifs" in that opening statment

checksixx wrote:

Odd...I've never heard of a single fatality out of a 117...

6 Total losses, 3 fatalities:

Aircraft number 80-0785 was ready for the first flight on April 20th,1982 unbeknownst to anyone, the fly-by-wire system had been hooked up incorrectly (pitch was yaw and visa versa) and the plane crashed before acceptance by USAF at Groom Lake NV, pilot Robert Ridenhauer survived.

On July 11th,1986, Major Ross E.Mulhare (aircraft number 80-0792) flew into a mountain near Bakersfield, California the cause of the crash has never been officially revealed, but fatigue and disorientation during night flying has been identified as a probable cause. Major Ross E.Mulhare died in the crash.

On October 14th,1987 Major Michael C Stewart crashed (F-117A number 85-0815) in the Nellis range just east of Tonopah, Nevada, disorientation en fatigue are the problem of these crashes. Major Michael C Stewart died in the crash.

F-117A 82-0801 crashed August 4th 1992 near La Luz, New Mexico, pilot ejected safely.

An Air Force F-117A Nighthawk (86-0822) from the 49th Fighter Wing, Holloman AFB, N.M., crashed 7 miles south of Zuni, New Mexico, May 10th 1995. The pilot, Capt. Kenneth W. Levens, 9th Fighter Squadron, was killed in the crash. The stealth was on a training mission when the accident occurred.

81-10793 an Air Force F-117A Nighthawk crashed September 14th 1997 while performing a fly-by demonstration for an airshow at Martin State Airport, 12 miles northeast of Baltimore. The pilot, Maj. Bryan Knight, safely ejected. He suffered minor injuries. Four people on the ground were injured and 10 families displaced by the crash, which caused extensive fire damage to several homes and vehicles. There were no fatalities or serious injuries.

F-117A (82-0806/HO) was shot down (March 27th 1999) by a SA-6 missile in Serbian near by Budjanovci. The pilot was ejected safely, a Combat Search and Rescue-team of the USAF brought the pilot back by his squadron.

nam11b wrote:

I remember hearing years ago that a 117 pilot also committed suicide in his airplane. I can't find anything to prove it though and there has only been 3 F-117 crashes that resulted in fatalities. The way I heard it, the pilot had a pregnant wife at home and found out that it wasn't his. If anyone has inputs on this, I would be interested.

On the F-22 note, I am sure our pilots could make it from Alaska to somewhere in eastern Russia, but you have to remember that all USAF pilots are heavily screened and have to maintain a top secret clearance. For a foreign spy to do it would take about 20 years of pre-planning (starting around 8 years old to make the cut off for UPT). Bribery would be an easier way to get one, but finances are one of the things federal investigators scrutinize for a DOD clearance. Pretty unrealistic overall, but the huge worry is industrial espionage. How tempting is a 100k for a guy working down in marietta to carry something out past security?

That sounds unlikely. If anyone is going to have an "even keel", it is those pilots specifically selected to fly a top secret aircraft like the F-117. For one of these pilots to just totally lose it "merely" because his wife got pregnant by another man is highly unlikely and awfully melodramatic, if you ask me. More likely he simply divorced the b!tch and that was that.

Quite honestly, this topic is so beyond useless it is useless for me to have to point it out...

Obamanite wrote:

Quite honestly, this topic is so beyond useless it is useless for me to have to point it out...

LOL!

Its just a hypothetical idea (like a Tom Clancy novel) don't be so serious.

Forum: F-22A Raptor

Hypothetically speaking...