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Elite Joined: Oct 30, 2006 Posts: 627 Status: Offline

Good points … yes EOR is the arm/de-arm place.

I think this procedure is mainly for alert jets. (and yes I’m shooting from the hip, because I really don’t know for sure)

But, since the electrical safety pin can be installed upside-down in the panel and the streamer not be a factor, the aircrew has the option to take a jet with a hot gun or not.

Example would be an ADX exercise where SJ sent some E-models to attack a certain base, the Exercise Alert vipers are going to intercept and engage in A/A, they don’t want a hot gun for this.

Mission requirements for a strafing run on the range, you will want a hot gun.
Two Cents

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Elite Joined: Jul 11, 2007 Posts: 666 Status: Offline

Once the power comes on (i.e. engine) the door closes and the pin stays in. (unless it has been placed on the outside of the panel before hand) No way to pull it after that unless he pulls the trigger Shocked

I think this is just a case of not removing an old procedure when the TO was rewritten.
There is more to arming the F-16 gun than just the pin anyway, so even if he wanted hot guns after engine start he would have to shut down if it was not config’d for it before hand.
Now if it was an F-4E then I would understand it, because you could arm the gun with one engine running for that bird.

Elite Joined: Oct 30, 2006 Posts: 627 Status: Offline

Correct about the door closing (I forgot about that) … see I told you I was shooting from the hip and don’t play with guns. Laughing

You can’t pin it from the top (where the hold-back assy is) if it was initially pinned externally?

Elite Joined: Jul 11, 2007 Posts: 666 Status: Offline

Not unless you climb on top and that's a No No. Something about a ladder next to the intake that just doesn’t work you see. Besides like I said there is more to it than just the pin, more doors to open and stuff have to be removed and so forth.

Elite Joined: Oct 30, 2006 Posts: 627 Status: Offline

I see your point … I just checked that AFI out again and last re-write was 04, and getting a bit dated.

Man, you really got me thinking about that hand signal now as all gun missions are normally planned and no question exists on what’s supposed to happen, EOR, etc.

Somebody put it in the book for a reason, and I'm wondering why Shrug

Active member Joined: Apr 22, 2004 Posts: 136

It is an EOR check for the gun. Cocked pistol with cranium nod. It is still used to this day. Typically when you walk out to the Jet, the rounds counter is set to on and the number of rounds desired to fire, 110, 250, 510 or what ever. The hold back tool is removed, and the final streamer pin (electrical safety mechanism) is placed to the outside of the door for removal at EOR. Two of the three items to arm a gun have been accomplished by the time the pilot walks out to the jet and only one item remains, pull the pin. No one wants a jet to taxi around with the gun armed and that is why the final pin exists, remove it and now hot gun. Forgive me for not mentioning each door by its access number.
The cocked pistol would be used if the only thing on the jet to be armed up weapon wise is the gun. Another symbol used more often, comm out, is the patting of the forearm followed by a thumbs up by the EOR chief getting consent to arm up. Followed by the pilot giving a thumbs up and getting his hands clear. At the end of the mission, I often see the EOR chief pat the forearm then give a thumbs down to dearm.

So the cocked pistol is still used but typically by the EOR crew, where we usually don't have comms established. In fact most of the comm out signals I've had to use are at EOR, since we almost always have comms with the crew chief launching the jet. So I don't think the TO is in need of a rewrite.

Elite Joined: Jul 11, 2007 Posts: 666 Status: Offline

F16guy
My active days were with F-4's, but in the last 20+ years with the Reserves and Guard I can not recall ever using the gun cock signal.
We do not have the luxury of as many people at EOR as the Active guys, so we double up most of the time working with the crew dogs. We have one dedicated crew dog to watch his guy and then he passes off to us where we use a full 3 man crew. The unit I’m with now does not fly guns as much as the Reserve unit I came from. But in both cases we never used guns unless they were dropping something in conjunction with guns. That’s not to say it would never happen, but just not a normal day if it did.
I didn’t want to go into detail on how it was done but you gave a good description for those who don’t know.

Active member Joined: Apr 22, 2004 Posts: 136

I've seen it twice. Both times at Hill, in a C model with a centerline bag and two ters. I was supposed to have bdu's on the ter's but they weren't loaded. But the gun was. BSA to the range, Dry pops and hot strafe.

Elite Joined: Mar 26, 2004 Posts: 656 Status: Offline

Okay. Thanks for the help. I'm writing a powerpoint to teach some of this stuff. Now I need some good pictures of the JFS open.

Refuel door open.
Brake check in progress.

Any other pictures of an F-16 been launched.

Thanks in Advance.

Elite Joined: Mar 26, 2004 Posts: 656 Status: Offline

I use the cocked signal all the time on IFE recoveries to confirm the presence of live weapons. Looking for that head to nod. LOL.

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Forum: F-16 Procedures

F-16 "system specific" hand signals - Need help