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Enthusiast Joined: Mar 04, 2008 Posts: 73 Status: Offline

Guys, here's a situation;

The trend of warfare today seems to be guerilla warfare or assymetrical warfare. But a nation whose armed forces is geared to COIN opns dreams of having a Viper in its air force. It's impractical to get a number of Vipers and buy dedicated COIN aircraft, thus the nation must take a choice. Surely, the Vipers can handle external threats while the COIN aircraft can't, especially if its neighbors have modern equipment. But can the Viper be a COIN aircraft.

My initial solution is partially. The Viper is a fast mover that makes it a sort of rapid reaction CAS. But its speed can be a disadvantage when its load out consists of unguided ordnance like small bombs and packs of HVAR because of the time needed to properly aim against mobile targets. PGMs are expensive and can only be used against strategic or high value targets. Surely you wouldn't use PGMs against cheap targets.

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Enthusiast Joined: Nov 01, 2007 Posts: 54 Status: Offline

Mk 82s are suitable for a Viper in COIN operations....

Enthusiast Joined: Nov 01, 2007 Posts: 54 Status: Offline

for a "what-if" PhAF Viper, i prefer the use of iron bombs in CAS missions... if i'll be asked, border patrol is the better assignment for our Vipers!

Enthusiast Joined: Mar 04, 2008 Posts: 73 Status: Offline

Snick wrote:

Mk 82s are suitable for a Viper in COIN operations....

just say the Vipers will be loaded with Mk.81s as the heaviest ordnance allowed by the CHR. Then mortar and artillery (105 mm Howitzer) shells adopted as bombs plus HVARs, Zunis and grenade dispensers. Smile

Enthusiast Joined: Mar 04, 2008 Posts: 73 Status: Offline

Snick wrote:

for a "what-if" PhAF Viper, i prefer the use of iron bombs in CAS missions... if i'll be asked, border patrol is the better assignment for our Vipers!

You're absolutely right. Cheap targets must be consumed with cheap ordnance. Hindi sulit yung pera kung barya lang sila. PGMs will only be loaded when a high-value target is at hand like when the rebs are gathering for an offensive. Beer

As for patrolling the borders (part of external defense duty), it could be a mean thing against the Malaysians, Indonesians and Chinese who prowled our western borders. Our Vipers can be a statement of national will to enforce our sovereignity over disputed areas. Guiness

Enthusiast Joined: Mar 04, 2008 Posts: 73 Status: Offline

CAS MODIFICATION. Since speed is not that needed, lightweight armor plates that can withstand a 12.7mm round will be fitted around critical areas. Stations 2 and 8 will be removed. Furthermore, a refueling probe will be fitted for probe-and-drogue aerial refueling by KC-130Es or HC-130H (at least, in my paper's view the PhAF will have 6 or 8 to support long-range missions) since the Philippines can't afford a KC-135. Wink

EQUIPPAGE and DISTRIBUTION. I say equip the Air Defense Wing with a squadron of Vipers (at least 18 F-16C Block 32) and a squadron of at least 8 or 10 F-15E Strike Eagles (modified with aerial refuelling probe) for air superiority and other strategic role. Then focus more on the 15th Strike Wing (who has proven, despite the diversity of aircraft they handle and limited funds, managed to put as many operational aircraft as they can) as follows:
16th Attack Squadron (F-16C/D Block 42) AOR Luzon and Northern Visayas
17th Attack Squadron (A-4AR Fighting Hawks) (flight detachments nationwide)
18th Attack Squadron (A-4AR Fighting Hawks) (flight detachments nationwide)
20th Attack Squadron (A-4AR Fighting Hawks) (flight detachments nationwide)
25th Attack Squadron (F-16C/D Block 42) AOR Southern Visayas and Mindanao
But the most important factor are those people that will be assigned to these modernized (updated units as what Gen. Cimatu calls them) units. The 100th Training Wing will be equipped with a squadron of twelve F-16C/D Block 32s to facilitate conversion training and serve as a strategic Viper reserve. The wing will have full responsibility that only career and patriotic Air Force personnel (and not those people who clamor for airlines or other high paying entities by using the PhAF as a stepping stone) will be assigned to these precious units. Also a dedicated maintenance squadron will be formed up to support these expensive birds of prey.
A squadron in today's Philippine Air Force is a company level unit. They possess at least 10 aircraft and operates only what their budget say. Wink

Enthusiast Joined: Mar 04, 2008 Posts: 73 Status: Offline

F-16A/B Block 15 OCU (that was embargoed from Pakistan) was offered to us and yet the stupid senatongs at that time where ambitious with the Blocks 30/32. you will really feel bitterness against the trapos in our government.
http://www.timawa.net/modernization-paf.htm Bang Head

Forget F-16s as COIN... get a turboprop.

Enthusiast Joined: Mar 04, 2008 Posts: 73 Status: Offline

SpudmanWP wrote:

Forget F-16s as COIN... get a turboprop.

Why?

Turbo-props can't be effective for external defense.
I'm just researching the viability of the F-16 in a COIN operations.

Enthusiast Joined: Nov 01, 2007 Posts: 54 Status: Offline

Viper is suitable when Red/Terror leaders are caught gathered in an area, let the Scout Rangers caged them & let a Viper deliver a GBU-12 on them...

Only Mk. 81s are allowed by our CHR???? Screw that CHR! What did they do when Moro rebs beheaded our fallen troops last year?? I'm so pissed to CHR!!

I agree that our OV-10s are very much suited for COIN missions ONLY...

Enthusiast Joined: Mar 04, 2008 Posts: 73 Status: Offline

Snick wrote:

I agree that our OV-10s are very much suited for COIN missions ONLY...

Amen to that. Many pilots of the 15th Strike Wing likes it. But they must frequently go to the gym to muscle out the controls. Furthermore, a Scout Ranger Combat Air Controller told me that the Broncos were noisy which gives away the element of surprise. Some of our Broncos were refitted with 12.7mm HMG on the sponsons replacing the M-60Cs for some improved firepower and making it a good COIN aircraft. The PhAF may be looking for additional second or third-hand Broncos. Cool

But a Viper will surely change all these but their employment will be against high value (like strong points) or strategic targets using PGMs like JDAMs. Wink

Probably, it may work if the Broncos and other prop aircraft be turned over to the Army's Aviation Battalion and be dispressed in four-plane flights controlled by a Brigade Commander based on threat levels. Let the Air Force handle the fast-movers. Rolling Eyes

Enthusiast Joined: Mar 04, 2008 Posts: 73 Status: Offline

Snick wrote:

Only Mk. 81s are allowed by our CHR???? Screw that CHR! What did they do when Moro rebs beheaded our fallen troops last year?? I'm so pissed to CHR!!

If you're that pissed with the CHR be pissed even more with a leftist group of people (?), the Task Force Karapatan. For sure you will ask God to give you a Viper loaded with GBU-31s, find their head office and when they are bunched together and bomb them on that same day. Twisted Evil

These people(?) are the real liars. They did everything to discredit our brave soldiers from battlefield victories from twisting the facts to threating the families of our soldiers. I'm with the Army thus I know the pain of being deprived with hard-won victories. It's very demoralizing. Many soldiers curse them that there's no place for them even in hell for their outright evilness. These people(?) are the symbols of pure evil. Devil

Enthusiast Joined: Nov 01, 2007 Posts: 54 Status: Offline

Hay... You know what, i wish that our nation have a leader like Hitler.... CRUSH ALL RESISTANCE!!!!

Hitler???

Naughty, naughty. Big No No

As for the F-16s:

Mount SUU-23A 20mm gun pods on them, F-16s could carry them I bet. Cannon rounds are a lot cheaper than the other stuff so it's easier to have more on hand. LAU-3 launchers are nice too, I bet the 2.75" rockets for them aren't that expensive either. Two Cents

Enthusiast Joined: Nov 01, 2007 Posts: 54 Status: Offline

A lesser evil Hitler... Except the mind of conquest is a big NO NO....

I'm just wishing for a leader dedicated of crushing all resistance or threat to our constitution..

Iron bombs are enough. Mk. 82s.

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Vipers in COIN Opns